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The longer I live, the more I understand, the more deeply I love -- the more time I spend crying and praying for those who suffer... I find no alternative in this dilemma, but to humbly and contritely surrender all that I am, to the service of my fellow sufferers. But I still ask: when will the pain go away?
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Maybe you are going through some period in your growth when you are particularly empathetic, or perhaps you are just a really empathetic person by nature. If it is becoming overwhelming, there are some strategies for dealing with the intensity. A suggestion I have is to visit the website link text. Best wishes. You're a winner LeeAnn... And we both know why... Bless you.
(06 Jan '11, 18:27)
The Prophet
LeAnn, you're the only one on this forum who doesn't try to pass judgement... I want you, and people like you, to get ALL the money!
(07 Jan '11, 12:02)
The Prophet
That's nice of you to say Neil. Have a great weekend!
(08 Jan '11, 05:36)
LeeAnn 1
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You cannot help the poor by being poor yourself, no matter how poor you get. You cannot ease the suffering of others by suffering yourself. If you are inspired by helping the poor, your strategy should be to teach yourself how to be a wealth magnet (in whatever way you define wealth or abundance), and then give that wealth to others or, better yet, teach them how to be wealth magnets also. This is what Bill Gates did (although I don't imagine that he envisioned it in quite the way that it has turned out). He built a large company, amassed a lot of wealth, and now uses that wealth to run the Bill and Melinda Gates foundation, dedicated to helping those less fortunate live productive, healthy lives. He didn't do it by living in a grass hut. Did I say I am poor...? Did I say that I live in a grass hut...? Maybe if you were to tell me more about your own truly heartfelt feelings -- your pains and torments, I could better see you as a wise and sincere counselor.
(05 Jan '11, 17:10)
The Prophet
@Neil: I could do that, but it wouldn't help you, or the people you commiserate with. Don't you see? The way I dealt with the feelings you describe is by helping myself first. That gave me the capacity and strength to help others.
(05 Jan '11, 17:26)
Vesuvius
The grass hut is just an image. It is a way to demonstrate the absurdity of those who think that the way to help the poor (in spirit, wealth, whatever) is to be just like them. You don't love people by feeling sorry for them. That's not love. You love people by having compassion for them, helping them in the ways that you can, and by increasing your capacity to love in that way.
(05 Jan '11, 17:31)
Vesuvius
Looking at your profile, I can see that you've already done many things to help others. Yet you still feel pain. Did you really think that you could single-handedly wipe out all of the pain in the world, and then your own pain would go away? It doesn't work that way. You are choosing the pain. The pain will go away when you realize that the pain you feel is your own choice, and you can set it aside any time you want to.
(05 Jan '11, 17:45)
Vesuvius
That's why I like the word "compassion" better. There is a subtle difference, but you can help people lift themselves up without bringing yourself down, and you can do it in a way that helps them stand on their own two feet, and doesn't require you to identify with their poverty mentality, or make them dependent on you for unlimited support.
(05 Jan '11, 18:31)
Vesuvius
It is nice that you have the drive to help others in this way, but if you've taken the time to post here, asking when the pain will go away, but your premise is that it is your pain that provides the motivation and inspiration for doing what you do, then I would suggest that the pain has become an integral part of your life. In my experience, such pain is borne out of a weakness in a person's own psyche, not by anything happening in the world around them. To put it another way, you value this pain. You want this pain. You even feel a certain degree of pride about it.
(05 Jan '11, 18:45)
Vesuvius
...So why would you want the pain to go away? You are too invested in it.
(05 Jan '11, 18:46)
Vesuvius
What is your question, exactly? Is it really "When will the pain go away" or is it something else? Are you asking for advice, or do you just want sympathy? I would be more than happy to commiserate, if I thought there was some benefit to you for doing so. There isn't.
(05 Jan '11, 19:37)
Vesuvius
Vesuvius, I did not expect you, or anyone like you, to answer MY question... I simply offered my experience in love and pain to help other searchers understand the question that I was posing for them to consider and thereby grow... You must have some ego, to think that I was asking YOU, personally, to relieve my pain for me! Are you a bleeding-heart charity? Everyone who walks this earth -- IF they are wholeheartedly and passionately living their lives, will feel love AND pain... If you don't -- you ain't living man...! You're just walking through!
(05 Jan '11, 19:51)
The Prophet
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Thanks for clarifying. I have voted to close your "question" as off-topic. Inwardquest is for questions and answers about spiritual matters; it is not a forum for general discussions, and doesn't really work well in that regard. Questions posted here are expected to be answered, not just read. More info here: http://www.inwardquest.com/faq
(05 Jan '11, 20:04)
Vesuvius
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True Love feels no pain because it sees through the illusion of suffering to the reality beyond it. A person operating from this place will feel compassion, and will help and serve others by empowering them, so they too can see through the illusion, without disempowering themselves by falling into the trap too. |
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I LOVE feeling the pain of living.. the pain of struggling.. the pain of feeling connected to All That Is, the Universal Father and than losing it again and again, just like that.. It's exciting! It's exciting to feel anything! Why would I be bothered by seeing people 'suffer'? How do I know that they are truly suffering? ANd to take it further Neil, how do You know they are? Who gave You the right to judge what is right and wrong, what is best for everyone? My experiences are of meeting people 'handicapped' and imprisoned in their own body, not being able to sit by themselves, or touch themselves properly, but I don't feel pity for them! I feel admiration for the role that I believe they have chosen to play here before they were born into the life they live now. Sure, we can go all day long, trying to chase our own tale saying "Oh, you're saying this and that and that is not spiritual, or not compassionate enough, you should change!" Well I say to that "Screw You!" I'm not a self-indulgent fuck that is saying that 'I'm the shit!', but I'm also not a whiny bitch who wants others to cry for my challenges or expect others to solve them for me. I'm responsible for how I feel and who I am, period and so is everyone else. If they want to put up an armor of whinning 'oh, i'm not good enough' or 'oh, i can't take so much love' than so be it! Everyone has their own way and time on which he wants to change and chooses to do so. I choose NOT TO get involve in a discussion with you Neil on a subject "When will the pain go away?" because it's not the pain that is the problem here. The problem is the attitude towards pain. I love pain because it makes me grow, makes me push myself further and faster to a time when I believe I will stand in the presence of my Father in heaven and come 'home' after a long and exciting sojourn. And until that time comes I have to comply with glimpses of that final experience and I'm okay with it. I'm learning everyday not to chase those ecstatic and profound experiences of feeling oneness of the whole universe and to actually LIVE my life the best way I can, being an example for EVERYONE who is being put at my way, even you. Do waht you want, feel what you want, but for Gods sake, be ALIVE and feel.. |
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we all create our own world Yes and we can choose to live in a world of ecstasy or a world of pain. Either choice is equal, but one feels so much better - take a clue 8-)
(06 Jan '11, 05:02)
Eddie
Yes, you can choose a world of abject suffering and pain, but why would you? The better choice would be to choose a life that gives you joy and love... the pain is just part of (temporarily) living on/in an imperfect world.
(06 Jan '11, 12:33)
The Prophet
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I dont think contritely surrendering for the good of humanity or any fellow sufferers will do you any good Neil. Your not Jesus mate. Your not meant to suffer The best way you can really and truely help anyone is to be stable and happy yourself. I hope you get to the state soon Neil Graham You have offended me sir... I did NOT suggest or say that I was 'surrendering' for the good of humanity or fellow suffers... If you were as wise as you would like to be, you would know that when one 'surrenders' (if that is what they intend to do), they 'surrender' to Jesus Christ. And if you were as noble as I know you want to be, you would not give yourself the liberty, on this format or any other, to make assertions or assumptions another persons stability and/or happiness. At this point in your career, a little contrition would do you no harm.
(05 Jan '11, 17:46)
The Prophet
And I'm just wondering Neil: What is it in you that's been offended?
(06 Jan '11, 04:58)
Eddie
"Contritely surrendering for the good of humanity" is a really DUMB thing to do... And a clever assumption on Graham's part, that enables him to cast me as someone who is less intelligent than he is... His thoughtless distortions of what I actually said, are offensive, and I believe are also deliberate.
(06 Jan '11, 12:12)
The Prophet
Neil,factually speaking where in my answer did i state that im cleverer than you? I will be honest Neil your question made you come accross as someone who is in dire emotional straits and needs help. Now i will stress that thats my take on this not neccessarily a fact. Often my ways of reading thingsb are not right,i will admit that.Now as for the " You have offended me sir " comment it sounds to me as if you need to grow up a bit.It sounds also to me that you .need to take yourself and this site a little less seriously. Also you posted the question not me,I gave MY answer
(06 Jan '11, 12:42)
Monty Riviera
When i ask quetions Neil i dont always get the answers i want. But i never take offense. I will aslo state that the answer i gave wasnt meant to offend you. I will however stick with the answer i gave. It seemed entirely appropriate to a question that seemed to me as being both self indulgent,childish and extremely negative.
(06 Jan '11, 12:46)
Monty Riviera
Graham, thank you for taking the time to clarify how you feel about my attitude toward you... You certainly aren't the first person who has seen me as self-indulgent and childish... But on further examination, most such charges have been identified as 'reflections' of self-doubt... That 'validated' information would suggest that your charges are not true -- but I'm open for valid proof to the contrary... That I have been negative toward you is true -- but that I am negative (as a person) IS NOT TRUE... I'm a scientist... People who LEAD with their emotions, tend to dislike the way I think.
(06 Jan '11, 15:39)
The Prophet
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When you are committed to the ones you love the pain will never go away permanently, because every time someone you care for feels pain you will also feel the pain, but not as real pain per se’, but pain you feel for someone you love from the heart! And once you can see the love beyond the pain, you will come to realize that there is no pain, only love, true love for the ones you love, and there will never cease to be a place in your heart to love, and care, and share, and give! A big heart you have, filled with love, to share someone pain, if not for love, and to surrender to all! Vee, you have the true solution-answer to the pain of love! I was wondering how long it would take most of the 'experts' on this forum to get it... To get out of their heads and into their hearts for two consecutive seconds... The greater the love, the greater the pain... That is IF the individual has the courage to BE what God made them.
(06 Jan '11, 11:57)
The Prophet
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Enjoy the struggle. The pain is a part of Love and can not be separated. Suffering for the sake of suffering is a form of control by extending ones emotional bubble. It is okay to acknowledge suffering, but this can deplete your energy greatly. I would recommend helping people in need. Maybe this will give you a sense of accomplishment to see that people are grateful, and to shift that focus to some positive and needed actions to solve suffering. |
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I have been there. It started during a year of intense yoga and meditation. I just had to allow it. It peaked w two or three intense sessions of just allowing every emotion of pain to be met w empathy. I know it had to do with cleasing my energy and that I was inspiring better for them. Thank you... When you say you've "been there" are you referring to love and pain... or what I've referred to as surrender?
(05 Jan '11, 20:05)
The Prophet
I refer to the suffering
(06 Jan '11, 02:02)
all2gethernow
For the pain of others
(06 Jan '11, 02:02)
all2gethernow
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Probably by this summer (July), if you work at it. Create a plan to overcome this. Start with 20 minutes meditation everyday, start the focus wheel, notes in a box, prayer, rigorous exercise, helping others and choosing to be happy. Then to help all this, pray for a spiritual awakening that will never leave you. Increase each every work. Keep notes. My question to you is - How bad do you want it? It is a lot of work but can be done. Somethings just don't "go away", we have to handle them... Good Luck. |
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Neil, I have been where you are. I know the feeling, I can still taste it if I let it. You see, we all have to go through this stage. It is quite painful, I know. What snapped me out of it and helped me move on to the following stage, active compassion, was my immediate family. To make a long story short, my family felt I was so emotionally fragile that I was in serious need of professional help, that besides their insistent demands of me doing more for each and every single one of them personally instead of for some strangers. Thus, my family's push for me to serve more of their needs first and foremost accompanied with the looming threat of having to be locked and drugged up in the psyche ward, helped me to pull myself together. What about the pain? I pray for guidance daily, and was able to find the missing pieces of the big picture. The stage you're in, you see and feel the suffering of others and it seems senseless. Later you get to understand where the suffering comes from and how it is one of the tools used to help us appreciate and evolve. Once there, you start serving others with your heart full of love and compassion for them and a deep appreciation for the struggle they're undergoing. You'd be there to help when asked and or whenever the need arise and you're called upon. I love you brother, it will get better. Thank you, namaste Thank you very much! I appreciate your insight on the problem... I'm not suffering -- but I think you understand the dilemma that I posed... I hope your family treats you better now... God Bless You.
(06 Jan '11, 12:43)
The Prophet
Neil my family is my biggest catalyst. And sometimes I do need to get my ass kicked to get back on path. We love each other and are devoted to one another. Forgive me if I seemed arrogant while answering, that was not intended. I don't know how else to help if not by sharing of myself and what feels relates to the subject matter. As for humanity getting its ass kicked, I pray daily for a better world where humanity would have a change of heart.
(07 Jan '11, 18:02)
daniele
Please bear with me, while I take myself too seriously, in the process of trying to avoid the social and economic 'possibilities' of the future... I can see that you are doing a great job of sharing yourself -- and I thank you for sharing with me.
(07 Jan '11, 21:03)
The Prophet
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+1 for having an entertaining perspective (apparently)
Eddie, you seem to be the only person on this forum who has a light enough heart to see my viewpoint for what it truly is... ;-)
Neil, as far as I can see, the people who've given you responses to your question have been sincerely trying to help you based upon the limited information you've put forward here. And you've been a little less than thankful to some of them for coming forward with their views. That's your choice, of course. But I think this forum works well because the people here are sincere in their questions and sincere in their answers. If we have to play the game of "guessing" what you really mean, it doesn't really help anybody. Just my viewpoint :)
Thank you... I believe that all of the responses are completely sincere... Being new to this forum, I think that I may have mistaken the purpose of the questioning process, since so many answers seemed to assume that I was complaining and/or asking for someone to 'rescue' me... My question was light hearted -- I don't suffer from the love/pain of living... In Christian theology (my belief) the purpose of life (everlasting) is to serve others... Serving others is a joy... Pain is part of living this human life.
@Neil - IMHO Eckhart Tolle says it best: "Pain & suffering is necessary until it's no longer necessary..."
Well now that the purpose of the question is clear to everyone: Welcome to Inward Quest Neil Roberts, and I am happy to share with you that everyone here at Inward Quest has great talents that we can all learn from, so participate, and enjoy. You are now one of us!
I don't understand Neil Roberts you ask a deep question about love and pain and you expect it to be understood as light hearted. This is a serious forum and the questions and answers or ask and answered seriously. Because people want a serious answer to the questions they ask. Now, please explain your self more fully if you want people to guess at what you really want.
Welcome to the forum and if you try getting serious it might grow on you and you may like it. Just my opinion.
We of planet earth are starting on the very lowest rung of a long, long ladder that leads us, through service to others, to progressively higher levels of the universe, to eventually live with the (elder) Sons of God ... To be anything other than contrite, humble and light-hearted in our situation would seem to be arrogance at the very least...
What an interesting accident this has been... I love 'spiritual' people... Especially the men, who have so much intelligent information about the condition of the human heart (pun intended).